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	<title>Comments for saintsjd</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.saintsjd.com/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.saintsjd.com</link>
	<description>The blog of Jon Saints</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:47:19 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Jeffrey Warren</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-296</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeffrey Warren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 15:47:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-296</guid>
		<description>Hey Jon - great ideas. I think some people in the comments are missing the fact that the architecture of git is *itself* an abstraction, and may not be the best abstraction. &quot;Just learn git properly&quot; is what people said about Windows before Linux (or something). We should challenge abstractions that are illegible or lead to repeated errors even if they are a closer fit to the backend. You can always dig down to see what something does under the hood.

A couple ideas:

This thread is getting long (great, but long) -- have you considered opening github issues for each of these sub-discussions? The &quot;undo&quot; discussion, for example. Somehow git issues tend to narrow down the scope of an issue and also help break issues into parts (separate issues) so that you can think about tackling each one narrowly.

Second, I was thinking about the vocab on &quot;stage&quot; - you know, i strongly suspect that if you look at each person&#039;s git workflow, they would be pretty heterogenous; a friend always starts new coding sessions by branching, then tries to merge the branch back into his local master before pushing. I actually never use the term &quot;stage&quot; and don&#039;t really know what you&#039;re referring to. I could RTFM but &quot;the stage&quot; and &quot;my stage&quot; is already kind of confusing. Just something to think about when developing syntax.

# Show difference between the stage and my code
&gt; git diff STAGE

# Difference between my stage and last commit
&gt; git diff STAGE HEAD

Lastly, I agree with you that &#039;git undo&#039; would be great. I think if there&#039;s a way to make it completely non-destructive, that would be super. This might mean:

* it would refuse to undo if it would be destructive
* it might ask &quot;are you sure, y/n?&quot; or require an &quot;-f&quot;
* it might store states which would be destroyed so that they are recoverable, even if that means adding some heavier infrastructure (this could be a hack, like storing diffs or whatever you have to do, or a rewrite of part of git, or it could actually create a new state which clones the state you&#039;re trying to get back to, but preserves revision history, like reverting a Wikipedia article. The latter would be pretty heavy but i dunno - just throwing options out there)

Keep up the good work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Jon &#8211; great ideas. I think some people in the comments are missing the fact that the architecture of git is *itself* an abstraction, and may not be the best abstraction. &#8220;Just learn git properly&#8221; is what people said about Windows before Linux (or something). We should challenge abstractions that are illegible or lead to repeated errors even if they are a closer fit to the backend. You can always dig down to see what something does under the hood.</p>
<p>A couple ideas:</p>
<p>This thread is getting long (great, but long) &#8212; have you considered opening github issues for each of these sub-discussions? The &#8220;undo&#8221; discussion, for example. Somehow git issues tend to narrow down the scope of an issue and also help break issues into parts (separate issues) so that you can think about tackling each one narrowly.</p>
<p>Second, I was thinking about the vocab on &#8220;stage&#8221; &#8211; you know, i strongly suspect that if you look at each person&#8217;s git workflow, they would be pretty heterogenous; a friend always starts new coding sessions by branching, then tries to merge the branch back into his local master before pushing. I actually never use the term &#8220;stage&#8221; and don&#8217;t really know what you&#8217;re referring to. I could RTFM but &#8220;the stage&#8221; and &#8220;my stage&#8221; is already kind of confusing. Just something to think about when developing syntax.</p>
<p># Show difference between the stage and my code<br />
&gt; git diff STAGE</p>
<p># Difference between my stage and last commit<br />
&gt; git diff STAGE HEAD</p>
<p>Lastly, I agree with you that &#8216;git undo&#8217; would be great. I think if there&#8217;s a way to make it completely non-destructive, that would be super. This might mean:</p>
<p>* it would refuse to undo if it would be destructive<br />
* it might ask &#8220;are you sure, y/n?&#8221; or require an &#8220;-f&#8221;<br />
* it might store states which would be destroyed so that they are recoverable, even if that means adding some heavier infrastructure (this could be a hack, like storing diffs or whatever you have to do, or a rewrite of part of git, or it could actually create a new state which clones the state you&#8217;re trying to get back to, but preserves revision history, like reverting a Wikipedia article. The latter would be pretty heavy but i dunno &#8211; just throwing options out there)</p>
<p>Keep up the good work.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Miller Medeiros</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-289</link>
		<dc:creator>Miller Medeiros</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Feb 2012 15:48:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-289</guid>
		<description>Check out git-extras ( https://github.com/visionmedia/git-extras ) not exactly what you want to do but it adds some new commands to git and can be an implementation reference. An interesting read: http://nfarina.com/post/9868516270/git-is-simpler</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Check out git-extras ( <a href="https://github.com/visionmedia/git-extras" rel="nofollow">https://github.com/visionmedia/git-extras</a> ) not exactly what you want to do but it adds some new commands to git and can be an implementation reference. An interesting read: <a href="http://nfarina.com/post/9868516270/git-is-simpler" rel="nofollow">http://nfarina.com/post/9868516270/git-is-simpler</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Eric Thelin</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-288</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Thelin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Feb 2012 00:11:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-288</guid>
		<description>Kudos on this.  I love your ideas.  I have been tempted to write such a translation layer multiple times.  I could name a few co-workers who probably would have to do a double take to make sure that I didn&#039;t either write this post or put you up to it :)
Keep up the good work!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kudos on this.  I love your ideas.  I have been tempted to write such a translation layer multiple times.  I could name a few co-workers who probably would have to do a double take to make sure that I didn&#8217;t either write this post or put you up to it <img src='http://www.saintsjd.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
Keep up the good work!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Are We Born to Run? by Jon</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2010/03/are-we-born-to-run/comment-page-1/#comment-287</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Feb 2012 06:13:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ituprising.com/?p=31#comment-287</guid>
		<description>It is amazing. I run almost exclusively in my 5 fingers. It brings me so much joy. And, since I started running, playing exercising only for joy I have been injury free. 

One other joy is that I have started RUNning errands. Seriously. I RUN them. Makes them so much more enjoyable and the short bursts of exercise are great. I hope all your runs are well!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is amazing. I run almost exclusively in my 5 fingers. It brings me so much joy. And, since I started running, playing exercising only for joy I have been injury free. </p>
<p>One other joy is that I have started RUNning errands. Seriously. I RUN them. Makes them so much more enjoyable and the short bursts of exercise are great. I hope all your runs are well!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Are We Born to Run? by Jule</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2010/03/are-we-born-to-run/comment-page-1/#comment-286</link>
		<dc:creator>Jule</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 08:49:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ituprising.com/?p=31#comment-286</guid>
		<description>I can only say one thing: welcome to the little family of barefoot runners :)  
How has your running been going since your article?  Gone those injuries?  Interestingly I note that you wrote this article at about the same time I picked up barefoot running too :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can only say one thing: welcome to the little family of barefoot runners <img src='http://www.saintsjd.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
How has your running been going since your article?  Gone those injuries?  Interestingly I note that you wrote this article at about the same time I picked up barefoot running too <img src='http://www.saintsjd.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Jon</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-284</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 16:25:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-284</guid>
		<description>Alright. I have a lot of reading to do:
http://gitready.com/intermediate/2009/02/09/reflog-your-safety-net.html

But, it does look like git reflog could be our key to one really awesome feature for git undo and git redo.

Having undo and redo are keys for usability. They let users explore without fear of messing up the system.

It would be great to have:
&lt;code&gt;# undo what ever git command I just did
git undo

# wait, redo that last git command. undo my undo
git redo&lt;/code&gt;

hg and bzr do not yet have this feature. We&#039;ll start simple though. And, keep this one in mind for the future.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alright. I have a lot of reading to do:<br />
<a href="http://gitready.com/intermediate/2009/02/09/reflog-your-safety-net.html" rel="nofollow">http://gitready.com/intermediate/2009/02/09/reflog-your-safety-net.html</a></p>
<p>But, it does look like git reflog could be our key to one really awesome feature for git undo and git redo.</p>
<p>Having undo and redo are keys for usability. They let users explore without fear of messing up the system.</p>
<p>It would be great to have:<br />
<code># undo what ever git command I just did<br />
git undo</p>
<p># wait, redo that last git command. undo my undo<br />
git redo</code></p>
<p>hg and bzr do not yet have this feature. We&#8217;ll start simple though. And, keep this one in mind for the future.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by George</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-283</link>
		<dc:creator>George</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 16:12:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-283</guid>
		<description>Git commands are like irregular verbs in a foreign language: there&#039;s no all-encompasing logic to them, you just have to memorize which words you need for each thing you want to express.

Your ideas are a first step toward Gitsperanto.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Git commands are like irregular verbs in a foreign language: there&#8217;s no all-encompasing logic to them, you just have to memorize which words you need for each thing you want to express.</p>
<p>Your ideas are a first step toward Gitsperanto.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Jule</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-282</link>
		<dc:creator>Jule</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 14:15:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-282</guid>
		<description>Emacs VC mode has excellent git support and the commands are easy to learn (&quot;vc-next-action&quot; for example does wonders).  I learnt git that way without ever having to use the complicated command lines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Emacs VC mode has excellent git support and the commands are easy to learn (&#8220;vc-next-action&#8221; for example does wonders).  I learnt git that way without ever having to use the complicated command lines.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Banezaka</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-280</link>
		<dc:creator>Banezaka</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 08:30:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-280</guid>
		<description>Good Idea! This is something we really need!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good Idea! This is something we really need!</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by dumas</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-279</link>
		<dc:creator>dumas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 04:05:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-279</guid>
		<description>Could it be possible something like a git undo with git reflog? 
http://effectif.com/git/recovering-lost-git-commits</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could it be possible something like a git undo with git reflog?<br />
<a href="http://effectif.com/git/recovering-lost-git-commits" rel="nofollow">http://effectif.com/git/recovering-lost-git-commits</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Jon</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-278</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 18:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-278</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll take a look.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll take a look.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Jon</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-277</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 18:51:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-277</guid>
		<description>I think we can do this using git instead of gum. That would be best.

also... what about git retreat instead of revert or undo?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we can do this using git instead of gum. That would be best.</p>
<p>also&#8230; what about git retreat instead of revert or undo?</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by David Watson</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-276</link>
		<dc:creator>David Watson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 18:44:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-276</guid>
		<description>Have you looked at Kenneth Reitz&#039;s legit?

https://github.com/kennethreitz/legit

It&#039;d probably be worth basing your work around what he&#039;s already done (a fork) if you haven&#039;t already.

I&#039;d love to have the ability to:

gum new directory_name

or something like that,
and have it setup a new git with remote, much like github mac.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Have you looked at Kenneth Reitz&#8217;s legit?</p>
<p><a href="https://github.com/kennethreitz/legit" rel="nofollow">https://github.com/kennethreitz/legit</a></p>
<p>It&#8217;d probably be worth basing your work around what he&#8217;s already done (a fork) if you haven&#8217;t already.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d love to have the ability to:</p>
<p>gum new directory_name</p>
<p>or something like that,<br />
and have it setup a new git with remote, much like github mac.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Roy Leban</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-275</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy Leban</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 18:27:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-275</guid>
		<description>I like all of this but the name. git, like many, many tools exposes its internals, its schema, in its user interface. It only gets away with it because it&#039;s a developer tool and there isn&#039;t the same expectation of usability that there is with consumer apps. As a user, whether it&#039;s of a tool or an app,  I want to accomplish tasks, not think about how things are implemented.

On the name, gum is all wrong. I&#039;d call it git. I don&#039;t know that this is the perfect proposal to clean up the git CLI, but something like this should be done to core git.

BTW, there is still one mention of undo instead of rewind in the post. Also, &quot;rewind&quot; doesn&#039;t have the right connotation for me. How about &quot;revert&quot; (oops, taken). OK, how about &quot;unchanged&quot; or &quot;re&quot; or something like that?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like all of this but the name. git, like many, many tools exposes its internals, its schema, in its user interface. It only gets away with it because it&#8217;s a developer tool and there isn&#8217;t the same expectation of usability that there is with consumer apps. As a user, whether it&#8217;s of a tool or an app,  I want to accomplish tasks, not think about how things are implemented.</p>
<p>On the name, gum is all wrong. I&#8217;d call it git. I don&#8217;t know that this is the perfect proposal to clean up the git CLI, but something like this should be done to core git.</p>
<p>BTW, there is still one mention of undo instead of rewind in the post. Also, &#8220;rewind&#8221; doesn&#8217;t have the right connotation for me. How about &#8220;revert&#8221; (oops, taken). OK, how about &#8220;unchanged&#8221; or &#8220;re&#8221; or something like that?</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Alexander Artemenko</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-273</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexander Artemenko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 15:29:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-273</guid>
		<description>Looks like yet another abstraction level over one of the DVCS.

It is better to make this wrapper work with any underlying DVCS or VCS, automatically discovering whether it is in the git, hg, bzr or svn repository, and implementing the same interface for all of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Looks like yet another abstraction level over one of the DVCS.</p>
<p>It is better to make this wrapper work with any underlying DVCS or VCS, automatically discovering whether it is in the git, hg, bzr or svn repository, and implementing the same interface for all of them.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Dmitriy Likhten</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-272</link>
		<dc:creator>Dmitriy Likhten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 15:00:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-272</guid>
		<description>Other things to pay attention to:

grb (git remote branch) is a ruby gem that adds the grb command. Very useful for branching, switching branches, fixing branches, etc. Sets up the remotes and everything for you. A great UI ontop of git branching.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Other things to pay attention to:</p>
<p>grb (git remote branch) is a ruby gem that adds the grb command. Very useful for branching, switching branches, fixing branches, etc. Sets up the remotes and everything for you. A great UI ontop of git branching.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by sheldon</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-271</link>
		<dc:creator>sheldon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 13:40:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-271</guid>
		<description>conflicts for stashes have a common fix in merging, which works for me most of the time, but isn&#039;t built into the stash command. here&#039;s the quick fix command. it will handle conflicts through merging, and if the merge is automatic will drop the stash. if the merge failed, it will keep the stash around for you to cleanup after resolving conflicts.

git stash show -p &#124; git apply &amp;&amp; git stash drop</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>conflicts for stashes have a common fix in merging, which works for me most of the time, but isn&#8217;t built into the stash command. here&#8217;s the quick fix command. it will handle conflicts through merging, and if the merge is automatic will drop the stash. if the merge failed, it will keep the stash around for you to cleanup after resolving conflicts.</p>
<p>git stash show -p | git apply &amp;&amp; git stash drop</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Esteban Ordano</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-270</link>
		<dc:creator>Esteban Ordano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 13:27:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-270</guid>
		<description>I think that something according to the huge shit that you can get into is this name for the feature: &quot;git destroy-working-changes&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that something according to the huge shit that you can get into is this name for the feature: &#8220;git destroy-working-changes&#8221;</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by ukaszg</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-268</link>
		<dc:creator>ukaszg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 11:22:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-268</guid>
		<description>The problem is git uses &#039;standard&#039; action names differently.
There is no unstage, unwind, rewind, undo, unmake etc. in any other widely used vcs.

If you really want to make a better cli for it, than I believe it should do what user expects it to do, for example:
svn user does not know the commands, so he tries first the commands that he/she knows, git fails here.

Look how mercurial made it: most of the commands make sense, and a person without prior knowledge of hg can somehow work with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem is git uses &#8216;standard&#8217; action names differently.<br />
There is no unstage, unwind, rewind, undo, unmake etc. in any other widely used vcs.</p>
<p>If you really want to make a better cli for it, than I believe it should do what user expects it to do, for example:<br />
svn user does not know the commands, so he tries first the commands that he/she knows, git fails here.</p>
<p>Look how mercurial made it: most of the commands make sense, and a person without prior knowledge of hg can somehow work with it.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Better UI (CLI) for git by Sharken</title>
		<link>http://www.saintsjd.com/2012/01/a-better-ui-for-git/comment-page-1/#comment-267</link>
		<dc:creator>Sharken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 11:08:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.saintsjd.com/?p=159#comment-267</guid>
		<description>@Undo renamed to Rewind:

I wish you would keep Undo, since it quite clearly defines the intention. Paired with a confirmation dialog, it would work just fine. 

Rewind is imo not a good keyword, it reminds me of old Walkman cassette players and not a Git specific function.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Undo renamed to Rewind:</p>
<p>I wish you would keep Undo, since it quite clearly defines the intention. Paired with a confirmation dialog, it would work just fine. </p>
<p>Rewind is imo not a good keyword, it reminds me of old Walkman cassette players and not a Git specific function.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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